Esther!

This topic contains 23 replies, has 8 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Richard Richard 2 years, 1 month ago.

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  • #1086
    Profile photo of Shira C
    Shira C
    Participant

    I just read the Pastor’s post about Mark Driscoll’s post about the book of Esther. I was amazed — I had no idea that the book of Esther was so neglected (and sometimes disliked!) among Christians.

    Maybe I should have known. I was raised in a Lutheran home, but it never took, because at some point in early childhood I was told that pagan babies go to hell. It was a deal breaker for me, and I began searching for another faith before I even got to junior high. (I did keep singing in churches for about 30 years, though, so I had plenty of exposure to Christianity. Now that I think of it, in all that time I cannot recall hearing anything at all about the book of Esther.)

    In college, under the influence of The Jewish Catalog (a sort of ripoff of The Whole Earth Catalog) I converted to Judaism. Of course, the book of Esther was now a big deal, once a year. Esther was regarded as a real — Horatio-Alger-meets-Wonder-Woman style — hero.  Contrary to Driscoll’s characterization, Esther was in my experience portrayed as a deeply pious young woman. Nor can I square my impression of her with Driscoll’s description of her as “ordinary”, since the ability to notice and make good use of every opportunity presented is not such an ordinary talent!

    Of course, the book of Esther ends bloodily, with a great deal of smiting and destruction and the incensed Jews “doing what they would” to their unpleasant neighbors. It was stories like that that eventually pushed me out of Judaism and into my present spiritual home, Buddhism.

    • This topic was modified 2 years, 2 months ago by  David Hayward.
    • This topic was modified 1 year, 11 months ago by  David Hayward.
    #1090

    David Hayward
    Keymaster

    Thanks Shira. I agree. I love Buddhism. I wouldn’t call it home, but it certainly is one of my cottages.

    #1093
    Profile photo of Shira C
    Shira C
    Participant

    In case you haven’t seen it, Mark Driscoll’s post has aroused some ire in this blog post. She makes some excellent points.

    #1095

    David Hayward
    Keymaster

    in my post shira, i linked to Rachel. thanks for linking it here though.

    #1097
    Profile photo of McBeth
    McBeth
    Participant

    Shira…..I just had to comment about how much I love your name. My son converted to Judaism several years ago and he just named his first daughter Shira…

    luv

    #1098
    Profile photo of McBeth
    McBeth
    Participant

    Thanks for the link….not sure how I missed it earlier this week. Love this quote:

    Is this not how women have been silenced throughout history–by rendering them either helpless princesses or dirty whores? And is this not how victims of patriarchy and male violence are treated around the world—as sexually culpable, as guilty, as “wanting it”?  Will we let our pastors do this to Esther as it has been done to countless women before? 

    #1100

    David Hayward
    Keymaster

    great quote!

    #1101
    Profile photo of Shira C
    Shira C
    Participant

    Sorry I missed the link on your post — I only read the tumblr version (with the Woman = Whore) cartoon, and it isn’t in there. (Just checked, because I was annoyed with myself, lol.)

    One problem with both Driscoll’s and Evans’s post is that they take the book a bit seriously for my taste. It strikes me as the scriptural equivalent of a comic book, so it might be better not to load it down with weighty moral issues.

    #1102
    Profile photo of Shira C
    Shira C
    Participant

    Hey, McBeth, mazel tov on your granddaghter! I hope your son is delighted with his adopted faith, and I’m so happy to see someone happy about a mixed-faith family! All the best for all of you!

    #1103
    Profile photo of starfielder
    starfielder
    Participant

    I’m so glad there are people like David and Rachel Held Evans who have a different view than the vitriol that messed up people, who have power and persuasion,  put forth as gospel. So great to find a place where folks can explore another way.

    #1128
    Profile photo of happylee
    happylee
    Participant

    I love Esther.

    I also live my life by “testing all things and holding on to the good.” (1st Thess. 5.21).  I’m into Bach Flowers and interesting conversations on the Bahai faith with my Bach Flowers Therapist.  I enjoy some of Buddha’s sayings, like if people expect only happiness in this life, they will be disappointed.  I am in love with Judaism.

    Yet I am of Christ.  It’s a blissful way to live.

    What I love about Esther is how God is present, in such a deep way, behind the curtain of Esther’s life and the events we are all aware of.  It fills me with joy actually to know that she was loved in such a way, that her story was preserved for us to read (if you believe that God preserves scripture, if you don’t that’s a whole other story), but I will just leave it at that.  Esther was loved, she lived boldly and bravely despite her circumstances, and God was with her.

    I’ve come to believe that things are never black and white, but different shades of gray.  And that’s where Grace comes in.

    #1130
    Profile photo of starfielder
    starfielder
    Participant

    I’m with you happylee, I like Esther as well. I think it’s a great story because it’s really how we live, in our culture guided by societal norms. Esther was just living her life in the norms of the day. And providence was in all of it.

    #1131
    Profile photo of Shira C
    Shira C
    Participant

    Yet another blogger (on Sarah Over the Moon) has decided to confront Driscoll! She begins by restating my own impressions of Vashti and Esther:

    First, there was Vashti. I’ve loved Vashti ever since a grade school teacher came to class dressed up as Vashti and told us the story about how she had been exiled by the king because she asserted herself and refused to dance for the king’s drunken friends. She was a brave woman who claimed her body as her own–rather than her tyrant husband’s–in a day and age where women were viewed as property by most people.

    Esther was always my favorite Bible character. As a kid, I loved her because she was a girl, and the Bible doesn’t talk about many of those. Plus she was brave. She was taken from her home and forced to marry a ruler who was oppressing her people. She was sexually exploited and probably raped, but still she boldly disobeyed the king’s orders, risking her life, and demanded that he protect her people.

    And she then goes on to contrast this with Driscoll’s view:

    ccording to Mark Driscoll, this brave Jewish heroine was “godless,” “sinful,” lacking in character, and just trying to trade in her virginity for a rich husband and a life of pampering.  

    What about Vashti, then, who refused to allow the king to sexually exploit her? Does Driscollpraise her effort to fight back against her male oppressor? Don’t be silly. Of course not. In fact, in his book, Real Marriage, criticizes Vashti for refusing to submit to her husband.

    Neither of these women can do right, according to Driscoll’s narrative, and that’s just the way he wants it. That’s how he maintains the careful hierarchy he has set up, with him and Cage Fighting Jesus on top. 

    I’m amazed and delighted that this particular dispute “has legs”. It’s always satisfying when people with harmful views are confronted firmly, but without snark.

    #1132
    Profile photo of starfielder
    starfielder
    Participant

    Nice work Shira! Thanks for posting for us.

    #1137
    Profile photo of
    Anonymous

    I actually wrote about it too.  Don’t feel obligated, but if you’re interested, here was my take: http://unchainedfaith.com/2012/09/05/the-godless-sinful-esther/

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