This topic contains 42 replies, has 12 voices, and was last updated by 
-
Posts
-
I had a conversation with a new friend who calls herself a Christian, but who is undeniably the opposite of most Christians I used to spend time with, because I told her where I stand and she still talks to me! I was telling her that I’m terrified of my parents in law, and how it’s really taking a toll on me because I feel like I’m living a double life sometimes. Recently I accidentally recommended a book to my MIL in a phone conversation. I’ve been researching the Paleo diet/lifestyle for awhile and I’m about to take on a full scale trial for myself to see if it’s what my body needs. Anyway, I completely forgot that the whole paleolithic mankind thing is a dead giveaway that the writer of this book doesn’t believe in creationism. My MIL was very aggressive and said “Wait, wait, wait, BACK UP THE TRUCK! Exactly which part of creation is this guy talking about?” And I “saved face” by saying something about, well of course he’s coming from an evolutionist point of view, but that she could take it with a “grain of salt” and read it since I think there’s something to his “eating for your genes” diet.
PHEW!! After I hung up the phone, I felt a rush of emotions. Relief that I had not been actually caught in the “act of being unchristian”…Sad because I really just want to be free to be myself…Angry, because there’s a LOT of information out there that is really helpful and GOOD that people like her will throw on the fire and IGNORE because the writer is an”on their way to hell, son of Satan, evolutionist”…I’m just FED UP!!!
It didn’t help at all that a girl I know who attends the same church as my MIL and FIL has recently informed me that they (my in laws) are her and her husbands “adoptive parents in the Lord and grandparents in the Lord to our children”. They call them by the same name that my children call them “Mimi and Papa”. She is openly hateful on Facebook towards atheists, anyone who has had an abortion, homosexuals, people who believe in evolution or anyone who disagrees with her about anything. She is unaware that I am no longer identifying as a Christian at all. Both she and my in laws believe that I still have the same beliefs that my husband does. (He believes in Christian Universalism) I held those beliefs for a short time before kind of “Falling off the map” of religious thought about a year ago. They know we don’t go to church, and have expressed “concern”…Anyway, I’m deeply disturbed because I saw a post of this girls from yesterday…and it said:
“When I post about my love for God I am not afraid of hurting people these people on here are supposed to be my friends. I am giving the facts and I have few non Christian friends. So if at all you don’t like me unfriend me because I use facebook to glorify God and share my life with my “friends” ! I love God he changed me and without Him I had literally nothing. Sorry if you think I am rude I am just speaking my mind.”
There’s nothing wrong with her believing as she does..I’m not trying to pick apart her beliefs in God and Jesus. I used to be there..I used to believe I was a pile of rotting shit without Jesus Christ. But I never in a million years would have dreamed of saying something like THIS to someone who says they don’t believe in God:
” He saved me of course I am going to worship Him with act, deed, song, and word everyday! He blessed me if I don’t give thanks and accept His gift would He be wrong to take it away from me? “No!” My life is good because of Him Without Him I was a messed up individual to say the least…. God is real I am a witness telling you that He is the reason I have changed He is the reason I have a home a loving Husband Food Love for my Children I am not perfect but imagine how I would be without HIm. God is real Jesus is the reason I am blessed alive and well. No drugs in 7 years God did that not me! GOD IS REAL I KNOW HIM IT IS NOT YOUR RIGHT TO SAY HE IS NOT BECAUSE THAT IS A LIE!”
And my MIL commented “You GO GIRL!”
Does anyone understand why I’m freaked out to ever let them know?
AnonymousI absolutely get why you are freaked out about letting them know you no longer share their Christian beliefs!! I would be too!
My entire family and most of my friends are Evangelical Christian church-goers and I no longer share their Christian beliefs either. I know how worried and upset they would be if they found out, (not to mention subsequent efforts to “save me”), so I try to just fly under the radar around all of them.
I did make one hugely regretable mis-step. My son kind of knows because I stupidly didn’t close my TLS tab one day when I used his wife’s Ipad. He ended up reading some of my posts and when he told me that I was totally freaking out inside! The only thing I admitted was that I was definitely done with church, but I still believed in God, and I hoped it didn’t affect our relationship in any way. He said it wouldn’t be a problem and then I sobbed all the way home thinking nothing would ever be the same between us. But surprisingly it really hasn’t changed anything between us for which I’m very grateful!! I want it to stay that way, so I don’t discuss any of my spiritual beliefs, doubts, questions, opinions with him or any other family members. I was lucky I dodged a huge bullet which could have had horrendous repercussions for our entire family plus his in-laws.
But I do get tired of having to hide this new and exciting spiritual journey I’m on. It does make me feel disingenuous at times. While I would love to have the freedom to just be myself, I am not willing to risk what it could end up costing me – a close relationship with my 14 month old grandson!
I really do understand your wish to simply be who you are around your family/in-laws. Only you can know if or when it will be a risk worth taking. But I do understand how crazy-making it can be!
Hang in there Mox! I hope you won’t have to hide your true self forever!
AnonymousWhoa. That is some intensity of the highest order. And I totally, TOTALLY get it.
My relationships with a LOT (most) people have changed if not disintegrated completely, including family members and it’s because I stopped being who they wanted me to be and started honoring my Self by being honest about Who I think this Self is at the moment, in the moment.
There will come a time when each of us has to decide between survival or tribalism. Maybe I shouldn’t make such a declarative statement. Maybe not. What I know is that I got really tired of being tired and scared. Having depression and anxiety disorder, you can imagine where this fear and exhaustion took me. For me, it became about surviving.
So I started to be honest, knowing full well that I would likely be rejected by people whom I had loved for a long time. And that’s exactly what happened. But it came to that for me – I became THAT tired and THAT hopeless and THAT physically sick. I wanted to sleep a full 8 hours. I couldn’t and it wasn’t any wonder why. I wanted to eat a healthy meal and it wasn’t any wonder why I wouldn’t honor my body. I wanted to invest my time and energy into the things I was interested in and it wasn’t any wonder why I wasn’t.
I was living in a constant state of fear of being abandoned and rejected. I was in a constant state of fear that I wasn’t enough for myself. That without these people and their approval, I might wither up and die.
I didn’t wither up and die. And neither will you. But go at your own pace. Don’t let me or anyone else tell you what road you should hoe, how to hoe it or when to hoe it. (Okay, this is mostly me telling myself to behave.) Shit, my experiences might be completely right for me and wrong for you. Maybe you are meant to learn how to walk two roads simultaneously and still be at peace.
AnonymousBTW – awesome surprising experience with your Christian friend who honored you.
AnonymousThis is a story which is always sad to hear – I find it really painful when there’s a sense that someone’s faith is a higher priority than their own family members. As far as my mum is concerned, I’m in something of a state of limbo. If she ever asks me about my religious faith (or lack of it) I will have to come clean, the problem is that I don’t know where she stands any more. She doesn’t go to Kingdom Hall – I think she stopped going if memory serves when someone let forth a tirade about women wearing trousers – and she was wearing trousers as she had either finished a shift at the hospital (she was a nurse till she retired) or was about to go on shift.
My Dad’s 70th birthday is coming up so that might give me a chance to sound out my sisters who live near them.
At least she doesn’t try to witness to everyone she meets any more! Now that was awkward – when some poor unsuspecting person appeared at a bus stop at which we were also waiting and Mum ready to pounce with her conversation opener about how awful the world was these days.
@eubielicious~”At least she doesn’t try to witness to everyone she meets any more! Now that was awkward – when some poor unsuspecting person appeared at a bus stop at which we were also waiting and Mum ready to pounce with her conversation opener about how awful the world was these days.”
RIGHT? Why is it that there must be this emphasis on the negative in the world? I think there’s probably more than one answer, but my guess is that you have to make a person believe there’s a problem that needs fixing before you can tell them how to fix it. It’s essentially like running around trying to be the best pitchman for an infomercial. First you have to dump dirty brown water and mustard on their carpet before you can show ‘em how clean the “super wonder sploogie mop” is gonna work for them.
I’m sorry..I talk a lot. I just have SO much on my mind all the time!
Wow Moxie. It’s so tough when you’re forced to live a double life in order to maintain relationships with others. For me the hardest person to tell I no longer believed in god was my grandma. She simply wished I’d changed my mind, said she’d continue to pray for me, and asked when I was going to come visit her. No drama. The opinions and feelings of others were important to me, but not as important as hers. When I finally told her I had gotten past the fear that had held me in place for years. Thankfully it went well, but regardless of her reaction, I wasn’t going to pretend to be something I wasn’t anymore.
There comes a point when you have to decide to be happy either living openly, or be happy living in secret. I’m not really good at being 2 different people and think the writing was on the wall long before I “came out” on Facebook. I’d long stop faking it, but didn’t quite say the words out loud, mostly out of fear. It’s hard for others to understand. A life without religion seems desolate and hopeless to them. I can’t count the number of times I’ve been asked how do I live not believing in anything. Initially I used to get angry when people tried to re-convert me. Then I stepped back and examined where their hearts were. Some were actually trying to use fear and damnation to control me, but the majority of those in my life truly believe that they’d never see me again in the afterlife because of my disbelief in god. They pray because that’s how they know best to deal with it. They’re not praying at me, but for me. I understand that and try to remind them that we have the here and now to make the most of. I’m the only atheist in my family and one of few amongst my closest friends.
I tell you all of this to not excuse your mother in law, but to help you realize that you not being a believer is a very foreign idea to her. It’s easy to say screw it all and live your life for you, but with changes in relationships, people need time to adjust. I’d try talking to her about it to feel her out. I doubt she’ll hate you if you don’t believe as she does, and there comes a great measure of freedom with honesty. Facebook is a very public realm. My friends post religious things there all the time and they don’t bother or offend me. However, my friends are not openly hostile to atheists for anyone else. People handle things differently when they’re face to face with it, especially if it involves people they love. Of course all of this is much easier said than done {hugs}
@Jo White~ Thank you for the understanding! Isn’t that scary? I’m always so scared that the wrong person will see/find out about my TLS page. I feel so “naughty”around Christians…LOL!
(((HUGS)))
@Tana I’m in that place right now. I am so deeply depressed much of the time, and I can’t seem to find life in my life! I’m feeling like the lack of being able to be ME is a big part of it…:( Thank you for your understanding! I’m really needing to figure out what I should do, soon..I just have so much on my mind and heart, and I’m so confused all the time..in addition to having chronic illness. Bleh! I really need to call you. I could really use a good cry…
@servantgirl Thanks so much! Oh, how I wish I could be sure she won’t hate me! The girl on Facebook who posted those things is hidden from my feed, but I looked at her page because she expressed feeling ignored by me..I couldn’t find anything she had posted that wasn’t jabbing at someone or some group of people..it stinks!
Anyway, my MIL and my FIL are both in very poor health, and I am scared that the stress of knowing that I’m an atheist might put them and the rest of that side of the family over the edge. I’m just not sure how to proceed. To help put things into perspective, my brother in law who is the middle son of their 3 (my hubby is the youngest) is basically an atheist (a very angry one) and he is pretty much shunned and spoken of in hushed tones like some kind of criminal. The oldest brother is a youth pastor who attended seminary, and he and his wife and 3 kids are ADORED and PRAISED by my in laws.Oh somebody knock me unconscious…:'(
I can relate to this conversation. The church group I was with for years are shunning me because of doctrinal differences. The pivot was the age of the earth. (They took a turn to fundamentalist young earth creationism). It then carried on to bible versions and their dislike of citing the original languages. Anyway I was pressured out and it caused a split in our family. Leaving with me were my wife, step-daughter and her family. I am totally shunned by my son and daughter-in-law. I have not seen my four grandchildren for 3 years. Since the break-up I have become pissed off with religion. I have no confidence that christianity is true. I quit praying, reading the bible and fellowshipping. I call myself an agnostic rather than an atheist, not ready for that just yet. Those close to me know where I stand. However I don’t think my son knows yet and if he were to find out there would be no hope of ever reconciling with him. He has since been affirmed as an elder in the group and is a sermon-giver and a small e evangelist. So I’m stuck between full disclosure and hiding my spiritual position. What I have been learning in this community is that I need to really be honest with myself and where I am at and be who I am and take a stand no matter the consequences. I am struggling with stress and depression so there is nothing easy about all this. Life is short and it is easy to miss out on the good in the here and now. Religion promises more in the after life, but it is likely just ‘pie in the sky’. Many are trading today for a mystic and wishful tomorrow and hurting loved ones in the here and now.
AnonymousI’m going to give you my opinion about this, which you can take or leave (not that you need my permission to take it or leave it.)
To help put things into perspective, my brother in law who is the middle son of their 3 (my hubby is the youngest) is basically an atheist (a very angry one) and he is pretty much shunned and spoken of in hushed tones like some kind of criminal. The oldest brother is a youth pastor who attended seminary, and he and his wife and 3 kids are ADORED and PRAISED by my in laws.
This is emotional manipulation. It is, imo, abusive behavior. We put up with abuse because the payout is worth it. When the payout stops being worth it, we stand up to it.
Anyway, my MIL and my FIL are both in very poor health, and I am scared that the stress of knowing that I’m an atheist might put them and the rest of that side of the family over the edge.
I do not mean to sound cruel and uncaring, because I am not cruel and I do care; however, even if you told your MIL and FIL you were an atheist and they dropped to their deaths at that moment, please hear this – that would not be your responsibility. It would not be your fault. And anyone who tried to pin blame on you would be guilty of emotional manipulation and attempting to control you through shame and guilt.
I’m going to share something that was said to me that spurred a real turning point for me (one of many turning points). I was in a similar state of worrying about who found out what about me and how that might make them feel or what it might make them do. And a dear friend said, “Well, don’t we think highly of ourselves?’
She could say that to me because I knew she loved me but still it stung a little bit. I asked her what she could possibly mean, that I wasn’t being selfish, that I was being concerned and caring. And she uncovered for me that in believing that my actions or words could have such a profound effect on others, I was basically saying that people hang their hat on what I do, think, say, believe, etc. And yeah, from that perspective, I saw what she was talking about. It made me ask the question: Should people hang their hat on what I choose to do? No, of course not. So, if they choose to be ruined in some way by what I choose to do, is that on me? Can that possibly be on me? No. Therefore, the choice to be distraught or disappointed or worried or physically ill about my personal choices for my life is wholly on them. I won’t take responsibility for it anymore.
I don’t know if that perspective is helpful or not. I hope it doesn’t come across the wrong way. I’m not calling anyone here selfish. It was just a good exercise that helped me clearly see where responsibility ought to be – on whose shoulders responsibility rests. I was placing far too much responsibility on my own.
AnonymousHugh – my heart breaks for you being cut off from your four grandchildren! I only have one grandson, and I can’t imagine the pain I would feel if he weren’t allowed to be in my life! I am so sorry! I know this is probably a pipe dream, but I really hope that will change somewhere down the line.) How people can be so blind is beyond me!
I have been estranged from my parents for the last 23 years because they are in HUGE denial about my dad sexually abusing me and my nieces. All they need to do is admit the truth, have some understanding of the excruciating pain they have caused us and be genuinely sorry and I would reconcile with them in a minute. But instead, they play the blame game, dole out undeserved “Christian guilt trips” and try to dump the shame that belongs to them on their victims. I’ve given up EVER being able to understand their twisted words and deeds. And truthfully, even if they were honest about the abuse and truly sorry, I don’t think I could ever re-enter their dysfunctional world of “performance/shame-based” religion.)
Like you said, we have to be true to ourselves first and foremost!
AnonymousTana – I LOVE what you shared!! So true!
AnonymousThanks, Jo.
Glad it came across okay.Wow wish you all lived near me so we could go out for beers. (which would be an abomination right?! alcohol! yikes!) But seriously, there are so many people I simply don’t talk with anymore. I have nothing to say to them. I’m choosing life. I’m choosing freedom. I refuse to sit back and nurse this bitter pill. So, I run, yell in my car, I paint and use my torch to make metal stuff. I write a lot. I write some more. I have found that I have more in common with the marginalized than those who think they aren’t. My husband and I right now have a favorite saying, “heh heh heh f**k you.” (that’s to all the naysayers)
I saw the play WICKED yesterday. It was fantastic! I loved it. So funny since my nice christian friends were up in arms about it’s post modern perspective. I found it inspiring. Maybe because I identify with the “wicked witch” who is vilified for how she is made and what she chooses to speak up about.
So to all you wonderful people, Moxie, Tana, Jo, Hugh, Eubie, Servantgirl – I’m glad to be here at TLS with you. I’m so thankful for each of your stories and perspective. I’m not alone. WE ARE NOT ALONE in this. And to me, this makes all the difference.
You must be logged in to reply to this topic.