This topic contains 45 replies, has 15 voices, and was last updated by 
Danielle 4 months, 3 weeks ago.
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love you all
And happylee thanks for all that you’ve been posting. Great to journey with you.
AnonymousThanks happylee for the website…
AnonymousLove what you are all saying about the church. I can’t add much that hasn’t already been said, but I do want to recommend a book called Pagan Christianity by Frank Viola and George Barna. That book really opened my eyes to the influences that shaped the institutional church into what it is today, why it is such an ineffective way to do church, and how very different today’s churches are from how the early New Testament house churches were.
I’d give my right arm to experience a “New Testament-style house church” functioning the way it was originally designed to function! But, I doubt I’ll ever find one, and even if I did, sooner or later – all of us being imperfect (and probably dysfunctional) human beings that we are – it wouldn’t be long until it morphed into something different than it started out as. So I wouldn’t spend much time searching for such a church. If you can find just one other person who is like-minded, start getting together and see what happens from there.
The church is NOT a building – WE are the church!
Jo White I could not agree with you more. When you are raised in one of the biggest churches in a country, and I mean big enough to have political influence, you tend to forget that the church is not a building. When I started my journey out of religion and stopped attending church to study the Bible on my own, I found that I did not change. My idea of the church most definitely did though. I was actually more free to love the way I wanted to. I could volunteer at a DV shelter that served sex-workers without worrying how other members of my church would feel about me not using my time with them to share my faith. I could attend my gay friends wedding and show them that I loved and supported them as a Christian without the fear of being judged by the church body. Jesus was with me always, not just in a building on Sunday mornings. I was the church. The loud fundamentalist group threatening hell was not the church. The liberal Christian group picking and choosing what scriptures were relevant was not the church. I did not need the intermediaries to have true relationship with God. Reading through my journal entries before I left religion many would be surprised that I walked away not believing because that’s when I discovered what church was really about.
I’m still on the spiritual journey I started in the church. This journey is about personal enlightenment, service, and love. It has nothing to do with a higher power than what I have within myself. Since I believe that there is so much greatness within me, and within us all, I can’t wait to see where my journey takes me as I learn more about myself and this world. However, that I no longer believe in God does not take away from the fact that the tools I’m using now were forged during my path to prove that the church was not about the building.
You guys are so great! If we all met in person we could start a church – and it would be different …haha – just kidding… That’s kind of the problem. Once something grows into an official “organization” things have to change. Structure comes in and rules and all manner of stupidity that we are all too familiar with. Love the 3 group Ekklesia thing Happylee. I do love what all of you have said – helpful resources too!
AnonymousHeartfelt ditto to all of you for your awesome sharing and insights! YOU are MY church!
Here’s an excellent article titled: Why I’d rather seek truth than defend an idea that I just read on the Patheos website. It’s a short article but it really shed light for me on why fundie-types take it so personal and react so viciously when you disagree with their beliefs. Just understanding what is behind their reaction makes me feel more compassionate towards them and might make it easier to talk with them.
If you want to read the 2-page article by Kevin Miller go to:
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/hellbound/2012/09/why-id-rather-seek-truth-than-defend-an-idea/?
OMG did I grieve .. I don’t think there is space or nuance enough to go over it because I’ve never tried to define it… but it took over 10 years.
For a long time at the very beginning I did nothing but cry and fall apart and beat myself up… I clung to any kind of “Christian” organisation, still attended a christian college… went to church… went to other churches… but every time I walked in or tried to “do the thing”, something in me couldn’t stay.
It was like trying to feel warm in a cold room without a coat. I felt forced out no matter where I went. Some Sunday mornings, I would ride in my car around town and just look for active churches. Sometimes, I would pull into the parking lot and try to get the courage to go in. Sometimes I would. Often, I would not. Whether anyone spoke to me, or even saw me was beside the point. I was trying desperately to hear something from God… anywhere.
And everywhere I went, it was like my head could not absorb any more. I couldn’t make myself do it, or listen, or sing… it was all nonsense and scribble and brought me to deeply lonely and agonizing tears every time.
It was a very dark time.
I’m glad it’s over.
AnonymousRenate – I’m sorry those 10 years were so difficult! I’m glad your grieving has finally come to an end.
Me too! @_@
What was it like when everyone else’s grieving periods ended?
Mine… sort of… felt like a veil had been lifted.
I’ve never really ever felt like I “fit in” anywhere, and that was more or less true with my experiences with church as well but I still grieved. Like David, it’s not something I’m totally over either. Even though I didn’t usually feel like I fit in, I felt like Christianity (and I’m speaking of it in terms of a culture transcending institutional churches here) I had a chance to feel accepted and loved by a group of people –indeed, sometimes I did. Now, I sometimes wish I could just shut my mind and heart off and go back into the community with a hope of having a normal and fulfilled life as many in that community SEEM to have. I know deep down that isn’t the answer but no doubt the road of a spiritual nomad can be very difficult.
I think it would help if I had people I could talk to in person with about spiritual things. More than anything else I miss having real dialogue with people. Internet conversations are nice but it’s just not really the same sometimes and even then I find there are few that I can really open up to about anything.
I know it’s been a while since this thread was started but I figured I’d throw my two cents in.
I think I started the grieving process about a year before I left the church so now I’m about two years into it. and yes, it has definitely been a grief-filled journey for me.
unlike many, my problem hasn’t been with the institution of church or folks that were members there as much as an issue with god himself. I felt so torn – loving the church members and feeling abandoned by their god. when I attended church, I had such a connection with the people but felt lost in every other area.
when i left fundamentalism and extreme legalism ten years before when I got kicked out of college (and my family) for drinking one glass of wine, there was no grieving process. finally I was in a place where I was free to ask questions and not fear repercussions for those questions not being “approved” or “beneficial.” it was incredibly freeing and good as I began to figure out who I was.
when I started going to the church I just left (where I attended for 9 years) I found family. they cared for me through two suicide attempts, through dealing with past trauma, in showing me that it was ok to just breathe and live and ask questions and not have to figure it all out.
my hubby and I were on the worship team nearly every week and were involved in every possible area of church life. when we left, it was really shocking to me to lose my family. maybe I was naive but I expected the same unconditional love through my questioning in regards to their god as they allowed in every other area.
I’m probably in a denial stage now though through my experience grief is rarely linear so maybe i’ll end up in another stage one day soon. I just can’t believe it’s over and that I don’t fit anymore into the one place I fit so well for nearly a decade. all I can say is grief sucks. it’s sticky and messy and confusing and takes a while.
@Emily Riley, I just can’t believe it’s over and that I don’t fit anymore into the one place I fit so well for nearly a decade. all I can say is grief sucks. it’s sticky and messy and confusing and takes a while.”
My husband and I have found ourselves over and over asking, “what was that?!” We were integral part of our church for 16 years. Now, none of those folks are part of our lives…so very weird that people can just “poof” disappear.
it is weird. and sad. but I’m hoping that it will be part of the process and in the end it will be a good thing.
I had some grief along with relief. It was a mixed bag. I think the main two things I had grief about was the lost opportunities because my religion didn’t allow certain paths I was interested in and the fact that I taught other people to believe in harmful ideas and placed my influence behind Christian organizations.
I like this Turkish proverb.
“No matter how far you have gone down the wrong road, turn around.”
I have never felt a part of any group because I was conditioned to see myself as an outsider. This had as much to do with my family of origin as it did with my paranoid religious training. So it’s hard to miss something I didn’t have as far as a social connection to my church. I never pursued that social connection because instinctively it felt toxic on an intuitive level for me. I just couldn’t take another layer of judgment, so my connection was only through areas where I could serve. The less 2 way social interaction I had, the less people could communicate judgment. So my interaction was usually only 1 way and that was to give my time and expertise.
At some point I have learned to enjoy the solitude. Once I removed the expectations and let people simply be who they are, I can interact much more freely because I don’t attach any particular outcome. People can pass judgment all they want because the only ideas that can hurt me are the ones I believe to be true. And interestingly enough what people pass judgment on often tells on them. So when I hear harsh judgment I simply open my eyes and wonder where that person is doing the very thing they are so judgmental about. I look at myself the same way. I find that so often the very thing I am harshly judgmental about is something I don’t like in myself.
I still grieve, but grief without the shame is much more tolerable and I can let it go through its cycle and I often emerge with a new clarity and motivation. I feel a slow steady power that helps me focus and gives me confidence. All the chatter about not belonging and she said or he said loses its importance. I feel connected to something steady and true because it doesn’t take an institution or a whole bunch of mental gymnastics to sustain. It simply exists in the light of day and flows without me having to support it consciously. I really like that place and it seems to show up for longer periods of time and more often when I simply let go and stay true to being honest with myself.
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