@jonshriver
active 2 weeks, 1 day agoForum Replies Created
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@BrianD “Some of what I saw at this church concerned me greatly, but I was willing to stay because of the people.”
That’s where I am at the moment. I don’t have many friends outside church and if I left I would be hard-pressed for community. The good thing is that our church isn’t fundamentalist in the strict sense and tolerates diversity, and I have a small group of like-minded friends. If we lost our current, very supportive pastor, that would be the deal breaker. I think my friends would say the same.
Go to the markets, the beach, the coffee shop, take a walk, do yoga, kayak, enjoy a drive out to a nearby winery, taste something new, listen to something inspiring, paint, draw, garden, enjoy the sun, enjoy a warm fire, go fishing, journal, cook up a storm, meet up with friends for brunch… My goodness, I can think of a lot of things I would rather do than sit somewhere I’m not even noticed and listen to a lot of shit that makes me think I’m in a strange parallel universe populated by plastic people with lots of baggage.
YES! Wasted time, lost chances, regrets. That is the most recurring theme in my life. What if?
But without those years I wouldn’t be where I am now, which is, fortunately, in a loving relationship, having a small handful of close friends, and having a consciousness and awareness I couldn’t have had before given the state of blindness I was experiencing.
1.5 hours listening to music I don’t like and someone talk about things I don’t believe–that’s it in a nutshell, though my church’s most recent pastor and I are about halfway on the same page (but he can’t say anything about it because his salary depends on saying stuff that is “theologically orthodox.”)
I am so over the formula-driven modern worship music, especially Hillsong’s Jesus-is-my-boyfriend crap. Yet that’s all they want to sing.
Truth is, I only go when I’m rostered on. It’ll only be a matter of time before they catch on and take me off the roster.
Certainly understand how you feel, except in reverse: my wife started looking into spirituality without baggage (i.e. going to church, Evangelical beliefs) a number of years ago and her interest in my total, sold-out involvement in church was lukewarm (to be generous). While she came with me to church and didn’t mind our kids being involved in all sorts of church activities, her attitude was “I can take it or leave it, but I prefer to leave it.”
Surprisingly, I started reading a little more out of my comfort zone and, over the course of several years, started to deconstruct my own church experience and worldview.
Recently, I mentioned that I no longer believe that Jesus was God and we had the best conversation about spirituality and religion we’ve had for years as she not only agreed with me, but added her own insights from what she had been reading and hearing.I would say that we are now fully on the same page, but I still find something in the community of my church that has, so far, kept me from breaking away completely. Many of my friends are progressives as well and the church (Baptist Union) has been moving away from dogmatism (though there are still those who are stuck in that time warp…)
By the way, our kids are now 18 and 20. The 18 year old has chosen to align himself with the church, with some exceptions such as believing in hell and rejecting the sexual theology of the dark ages, and the 20 year old is a confident SBNR adult who has recently moved out of home with her wonderful and loving non-religious boyfriend.
There is hope. Hang in there.
It’s too easy for me to get stuck in the pigeonhole mentality that attempts to label people by their beliefs and see them in some ‘other’ area than myself. I really appreciate your picture of this multi-shaded space in which people live and move, kind of fluid-like. I see the potential people have to change and move around on this space both from darker areas to lighter areas and vice versa.
Having a history deep in fundamentalism, I still find myself defaulting to the labelling agenda. Even as more of a progressive SBNR person, I find the objects of my judgementalism are now the conservatives, right-wingers and fundamentalists. It’s a lot easier to leave the beliefs than the legalistic mindset.
I think that if I were to look at all those around me as having this kind of potential, it would change the way I interact with them, possibly with more patience and compassion, certainly with a greater desire to understand.
Thanks so much for your insights.To me the bad memories bring more a sense of shame than anything else. I remember more how the situation made me feel rather than what actually happened. And that usually results in an audible groan, a self-inflicted derogatory remark, or a general feeling of regret.
The worst memories are those of when I, in my zeal and ignorance, inflicted pain (in the form of rules, demands, accusations, judgement) on others. I’m thankful there were many gracious people in my life with a far more long-term outlook than myself, yet in my narrow-minded way of seeing the world, they were targets.
I am aware now, having come out of the fundamentalism of my earlier days, that there is nothing I can do to change how I was. It is what it is. I can, however, learn from my past and move forward. (Easy to say; hard to do. I struggle heaps with that.)
I don’t think I’ll ever be able to not remember, and I will possibly still recoil in disgust and some of those memories. That’s life. I need to own that. Truth is, a lot of that crap shaped who I am and remembering it helps to keep me grounded. I just wish I had a way of getting rid of the feeling bad part.
Hey Susan.
Thanks for sharing your story. I like your ‘Zen Christian’ label. In my church experience, I shared on Facebook once that I felt like I was a Zen Christian and I got all sorts of abuse over it (the karma was that my biggest abuser got really nasty and, because of that, the pastor had to reluctantly pull her out of a leadership election ballot.)But I have always felt out of place in organised church … except for the music, like you. I lead services, sing and play piano (and feel really hypocritical about it most days, but the music does something to me and, for that reason and a couple of close friends I stay).
May you find peace in God and in your experience of God and may your pathway be strewn with serendipitous moments of grace and love.
